Black and Blue 4GF -- Early Feedback ...

Three black "canvas" decked 4GF Fatties are now out in the water, and the first feedback has been coming in over the past week.

I'm going to refrain from drawing any conclusions based on this early input, other than to say that the bounceback has been positive enough to warrent ordering rolls of both styles of the new fabric (the coarse black nylon canvas, and the thinner blue nylon twill). I'll get enough to generate 30 mats. It will take about a month to get everything on-line and into production. Our web site at fourthgearflyer.com will reflect these changes in the next few days.

The new mats are in the hands of Jeff C, GG, and our genial host, Mat Max. Not a bad line up of mat riding talent!

Here are their comments as I received them. Sorry if this is kind of long, but I wanted to include all of the nuances, because the reponses were very thoughtful ...

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From Jeff, March 9, 10:00 PM

Paul,

The Eagle Has Landed!

That is some stout material on the deck! In some ways it's more like I expected a mat to feel before I actually ever had one; if that makes any sense. I have the day off tomorrow and will try to get her into some waves and I'll absolutely be able to give you some feedback on the traction action.

THANK YOU, and I'll talk with you tomorrow afternoon or early evening.

Jeff C.

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From Jeff, March 10, 2:00 PM:

Hey Paul,

I just got back from a couple hours in the water. The waves were 1-3 high tide peaks, with the tide going out quick. The mat broke loose and went down the line just about the same as my other Fatty. Of all the 30 or so waves that I got, four or five came through that were head-high and the new mat felt really good on those. The speed and control seem to be about the same but the feeling seems to be muted a little bit. I don't mean a negative "dead" feeling, but more of a Cadillac feel.

I already think (as much as you can from one mediocre surf) that I would reach for this mat on any windy or bigger-than-small day and on the couple of actual waves today it seemed that you could mash your hips into it a bit more without over-muscle-ing it. It has a real nice secure control feel. I wish it was 5 foot and offshore; I know it would rip.

As far as the grip of the new deck, I over-inflated it a bit at the start and slid up into a riding position a bunch of times as I paddled out. And, as I arm paddled I really leaned back seeing if she would squirt out the front and she never did. I am real happy with the grippiness. When I was in the water, I had decided that the new deck was 85% as grippy as the diamond grip, but really I think it's probably about the same, but different.

I bet you would really dig the old school feel, having ridden all the different mats!

I kept thinking that I had too much air in the mat and after going back and forth pressure-wise (thinking that maybe this thing likes a bit more air in it than the other) I came to the conclusion that it only feels like it has more air in it than the other, and still it rode the best with a moderately easy 90 degree bendability. It's hard to know how something really goes until you're fully used to it. That said, my day one feedback is two thumbs up. I'll keep you posted and thank you for the test drive!

Gotta go warm up,

Jeff

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From Jeff, March 10, 8:00 PM

Hey Paul,

Don't put too much credence into my previous "85% as grippy" figure. If anything, the deck felt slippery on my hands and not on my chest/body. And, if I had been coming off a canvas strips deck, it would've definitely been grippier. It must be funny to be trying to balance feedback from different people in very different waves and conditions.

Jeff

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From Max, March 12, 10:00 PM

Hi PG,

The courier came this afternoon... and it's Victory At Sea out there. Relentless six foot slop closeouts with 20 knots cold onshore. Probably couldn't make it out, and don't know what I'd do if I did. Tomorrow is meant to settle down.

The Black and Blue 4GF looks very sturdy and feels just right. I reckon it will go fine, especially in juice. To be fair, I'll wait until the conditions are a bit more manageable, so as not to get off to a biased start with this somewhat subjective research. Aesthetically, the new materials are very appealing. I really like the blank black top and the bottom material is easy on the eyes while lending just a bit of flash. If there's any hope of getting some rides, I'll hit the surf in the morning.

Good Work Mate,

Max

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From Max, March 13, 1:00 PM

Hey Paul,

It's still pretty hectic at our beach. I'm going up the coast in the car to more protected spots to see if there's a go-out.

Cheers,

Max

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From Max, March 14, 1:00 AM

Hi Paul,

Okay, I went up the coast with my mom and dad to have lunch with some friends, at a beach blocked from south swells, and rode 1'-2' junk with bad wind. The top feels much more solid and stable with less reliable grip. I wore a nylon skin wetsuit and found reduced traction with better control over shifting around than using less body-hopping to reposition myself. Sliding fore and aft is ideal. Sideways grip is less than optimal (in my nylon wetsuit). The bottom skin feels like it might have less drag/more glide. Won't know until the sea cleans up. Definitely a more solid feel and much easier to use overall.

Real potential for juicy waves. Possibly more holding power on steep faces. (Really just conjecture at this point.) Overall, I like the feel of having a big traction surface with no edges on it. Grip is similar to the canvas strip 4GFs and probably twice as reliable. (Only distant memories to compare to.) The ride was smoother with more shock dampening. I'm really keen to get some big hollow waves on the Black and Blue. I reckon that adapting is simply a matter of adjustment over time. My bet is that the ability to shift around while not unweighting as much is the primary asset. So far so good. Definitely feels like it will turn well and offer smoother, more controlled rides. (Based on one marginal go-out.) Most definitely inconclusive! But I like it!!!

Pray For Surf,

Max

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From Jeff, March 14, 10:00 AM

Paul,

I just got out of the water and have gotta jam to work, but she really works in some waves. This mat is definitely a success. It seems like this mat has a bit more of an inertia feel and that maybe the bottom material grips the water a little more or a little differently making it easy to subtly load it up and stall, or relax it to jet away. The "hold-in" of the bottom material seems to me to make for better control all around and the added weight of the deck feels more secure too.

I also think you don't have to "check" or guide the outside nose rail/corner as much as on the regular Fatty. And still, the top end speed seems to be the same when your inflation level is dialed in right. I could go into more personal observations but basically I think that in waves over two feet it is an improvement and to me, it is easier to ride than my first Fatty.

Thank you!

Jeff

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From Max, March 14, 2:00 PM

Hi Ya Paul,

Went out this morning in very confused 5' storm waves with slight offshore wind. I was the only taker on a two mile long beach frequented by staunch Sunday surfers. Two rides in 45 minutes. Lots better deck grip with a four year old full suit. Yesterday's session was in a cheap chainstore wetsuit.

Speed was good today. More hold on the wave face than thinner mats. Much better suspension characteristics. Way less jiggly than stock 4GFs. Definitely soaks up bumps and holds a truer line. Still not much to go on, but all impressions are favorable, especially how the the feeling is more traditional, with the underlying performance of a modern mat. For we old schoolers, the retro top would provide a more mat-like impression. And for neophytes, the overall ease of handling will make the initial go-outs more manageable and less disconcerting, because the the thicker materials provide a significantly more solid and stable object to work with.

The swell is dropping now and there's no wind, so I'll probably have more details to report in a few hours.

Cheers Mates,

Max

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From Max, March 15, 1:00 AM

Paul,

I trunked it for half an hour at sundown, found adequate deck grip, and didn't get roughed up by the canlon top. So, the new top is quite trunkable for occasional bareback surfs. I'll have to keep at it until I develop a rash to know the timetable on that.

Still no clean faces for over five seconds. In those short periods everything seemed pretty much the same as on the stock Fatty, except for being smoother and more stable. I'm guessing that the Black and Blue models will turn out to deliver equal performance with different character.

I really really like knowing that you're not working with stinky adhesives! I'll not be disappointed if 4GFs switched over to the Black and Blue construction. I reckon I'd want L or XL most of the time with the new materials. One big plus is that the new materials are less squirmy, whereas the thin nylon is always trying to wriggle. The Black and Blue mat is easier to punch through waves and negotiate turbulence. Some people will surely miss the delicate feel of the thin cloth. I would for a few go-outs, but then adapt and carry on. Overall, it would seem that the B&B prototype is the basis for a very viable surf mat.

Max

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In the middle of the week, George called with his impressions. I scribble down notes as he was conversing, and this is the gist of it...

"The black canvas decked mat went as fast as the old thinner material. I couldn’t tell any difference."

"My blue mat (George has an all blue twill Standard) was fast, and it might even hold into waves a bit better."

"On my black canvas decked Fatty, I could slide around on it without the mat wanting to fold or wrinkle. I could make one inch adjustments front to back or side to side. There were a lot of 'positioning skills' we learned riding canvas mats for over 30 years, and we haven't been able to utilize them to a large extent with the thinner nylon mats."

"The deck felt stiffer, without affecting the performance. I have to get more waves on it, but it seemed like I could work the deck of the mat with my body easier, because the top wouldn't cave in when I rolled my hip into either of the outer pontoons."

"In larger surf, you might get knocked off the mat with the canvas deck a bit more than with the rubber grit or Vulkem. But the grip is better than a new Hodgman, and we rode those for decades with no worries. I don't see any reason not to use this stuff on the deck. I liked it straight away."

"The black canvas deck mats would make good photography mats, because the deck is tougher and stiffer than the thin mats."

G.G.

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Back to Paul...

I was suprised by a couple of things that surfaced in all three reports. One is that the blue twill bottoms held into wave faces better. The other is that there was no apparent loss of speed with the heavier deck, even before the deck material started to break in. Both observations were unexpected, but happy, outcomes.

And, of course we will make an all blue twill 4GF for anyone who wants to use thinner material on the deck and bottom.

More later, as we get more feedback...

PG

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Update, March 15:

Call From George:

George called to say that he wants a Standard Black and Blue 4GF, and that Boyd, Roger and Steve, who are all heavier than George, have tried the black canvas decked Fatty, and "really like it."

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Email from Mat Max:

Hi Paul,

The waves cleaned up a bit and I trunked it again with no rash. Now that I'm used to the new materials, I'm back to not thinking and simply having fun. The only highly significant difference is the feel of the deck. This is a great mat. I'm claiming it's a step forward toward a tougher more utilitarian product...nothing is lost, while ease of use/durability are improved.

Intuition tells me that the heavier fabrics lend themselves to going up in size...

Stoked,

Max

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Happy St Patrick's Day! This just in from Max...

Hi Paul,

Yeah, this is great! I'm getting in the water much more in the name of science. Rather than having another coffee and waiting for a better day, I'm going out in really marginal conditions, and keeping the stoke up even when there are no good rides to be had.

The Blacktop is going fine, although the surf has not been so hot. I'm trunking it daily with no ill effects so far. The sun has returned and the sea is glassy again. Now we just need a bit more swell....

Cheers,

Max

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